S2E3: A Twist of Fate: ESFJ & ISFJ Compatibility
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You can listen to the full episode of our podcast on Personality Love Lab, Spotify and Apple Podcasts.
This week we explore ISFJ and ESFJ compatibility with Eliana and Jon from New York. Eliana (ESFJ) and Jon (ISFJ) first met back in 2014 at a party. Jon was captivated but Eliana had a boyfriend at the time. They both continued to live their lives, and Jon would think about Eliana from time-to-time, until one day, over a year later after Eliana had broken up with her boyfriend, they reconnected on a dating app. Sparks flew and they are now married with a baby.
Eliana is a millennial success coach. You can find more information on her website and her Instagram account.
Lou (ESFJ): Hi! Welcome to Personality Love Lab, where we interview real couples to delve deeper into the 16 personality types and love.
Jess (INFP): This podcast is brought to you by the two sisters who co-founded So Syncd.
Lou (ESFJ): So Syncd is the dating app that matches compatible personality types.
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Jess (INFP): Download it today for free to find your perfect personality match and make meaningful connections. It's available in your iOS or Android app store.
Lou (ESFJ): We’re your hosts. I'm Lou, an ESFJ, also known as So Supportive.
Jess (INFP): And I'm Jess, an INFP, also known as So Unique.
Lou (ESFJ): Today on Personality Love Lab we have Eliana and Jon from New York. Eliana and Jon are 32 and have been together for 5 years.
Eliana is an ESFJ, also known as So Supportive and Jon is an ISFJ, also known as So Nurturing. It’s funny – our Mum is an ESFJ and our Dad is an ISFJ, so the same personality type pairing.
Eliana is a millennial success coach. You can find her at www.elianagoldsteincoaching.com or Eliana Goldstein on Instagram. We’ll add these to the show notes.
So to begin with, how did you guys meet?
Jon (ISFJ): So it's not a long story, although I make it long. We met, well, at least I met her at a party that she doesn't remember in 2014. I remember she walked through the door, and I'm not making this up to make it sound dramatic, I was like, “Who is that girl?” I had a full cup of tequila. I went into the kitchen, poured it out, poured a new drink because she was in there and I started talking to her. And I was just like, I don't want to say mesmerized because she's going to get a little too confident over here, but I felt something different. It wasn't this typical, “Oh, there's a good-looking girl. Uh, let me go talk to her.” There was something a little different. And we spoke in the kitchen and then I went to the party after, but she went somewhere else.
It turns out she had a boyfriend, so nothing happened after that. And then, call it about a year and a half later, I was on a different dating app, before you guys came out with your thing, otherwise we would’ve used yours, and I saw her and I was like, “That's that girl!” So I swiped right. Of course, she swiped right too and we started talking. I played it cool. Turns out she’d lived a block and a half from me for the past year in the East Village in New York. I took her out a few weeks later and now we're married and have a kid.
Jess (INFP): So cute. So during that time between meeting in person for the first time and then meeting on the dating app, did you think about each other much?
Jon (ISFJ): So I'll speak for her, she didn't even remember me, so no. But I, without sounding like a stalker, definitely did think about her. And I was looking to find a girl that made me feel that way that I felt in that kitchen that night. And how lucky am I that I actually somehow someway got paired back up with her and it obviously worked out. Yeah. I thought about her for sure. Not all the time. I'd be like, “I need to find a girl who makes me feel that way.”
Eliana (ESFJ): So he said I was in a relationship at the time, which obviously didn't work out. Thank goodness. But when I did connect with him on the dating app, I recognized him immediately. And I was like, “Oh, I know this person.” I couldn't pinpoint from where, but I remembered him and remembered having a conversation with him. I remembered something. So right when I saw him, I was like, “Oh, I definitely want to go out with this guy.” So there was something on my end.
Jess (INFP): That's a really cute first meeting story I have to say.
Jon (ISFJ): Yeah, it is. It's funny to think back to that's how it started. And through an app that I was maybe about to delete because it just wasn't working out for me so well. It was fortuitous that I didn't, I saw her then swiped right. And like I keep saying; here we are. It's beautiful to look back at that time and be like, “What are the chances of that all aligning.”
Jess (INFP): Yeah. So what was your first date like?
Eliana (ESFJ): So we met at this small little restaurant in the Soho area of New York City, called Café Select. And I remember very well, Jon had texted me that day and he was like, “I'm just letting you know, I'm going to be showing up at this date in a full suit.” And I was like, “Okay, that's weird. Why are you showing up in a full suit?” And he gave me this whole story of how he's actually taking his mom to a wedding. He was going be his mom’s date at the wedding and he was going it come straight from the wedding to meet me. And I was like, okay, is he just saying that because he wants to show up in a suit and be super dapper, or if not, if he's actually taking his mom to a wedding as her date, that's just the cutest thing ever.
So he showed up and he was in a full suit.
Jon (ISFJ): I looked good that night.
Eliana (ESFJ): He did look good. So we just had some drinks, had some food. And it was on our first date that we connected instantly. I think after that restaurant, we ended up going around the corner to a bar at a hotel and we opened up about everything. I shared with him about how I was in therapy and things that I was working through. And he shared with me about how he just started working with a life coach and we very instantly felt really comfortable with one another and shared a lot of personal things that were going on in our lives. And I think we definitely had really a good chemistry from the start. I don't know if you agree with that?
Jon (ISFJ): No, I completely agree. I think with any date, it's obviously a little nerve wracking at first, just the waiting, the anticipation, but obviously it was a little heightened on this one because this was the girl from a year and a half ago at that party. So there was a little extra anxiety, but the second we sat down, like she said, we were just super comfortable with each other. We just both took these leaps of faith and just divulged so much stuff. And we were vulnerable to each other on day one. And I don't think either of us were intimidated by it or turned off by it. We were both embracing it and it was great. And like she said, we spent a couple of hours at that first place and we were having such a good time that we went to the next place and then we walked each other home kind of thing. It didn't feel like a first date. It almost felt like, and I know this sounds so cheesy, it felt like we kind of knew each other. Because we learned so much about each other that you don't typically learn about on a first date, we learned so much about each other then. So, it definitely was an awesome start to all of this.
Lou (ESFJ): How long was it until you saw each other again? What happened after that?
Eliana (ESFJ): I think it was pretty soon afterwards. Definitely within like a week or so afterwards we had met up again.
Lou (ESFJ): And then obviously you said Eliana caught your eye at the party, but what really first attracted you to each other?
Jon (ISFJ): Well, for me, I mean, I don't want to sound, but she obviously looked beautiful that night. I mean it obviously wasn't as deep the first time I met her because we only spoke for a few minutes, but on our first date, what really attracted me was what we said before, just how open we both were together and how comfortable we felt. And we had some shared interests, just music and other stuff that we did. So there's a lot of things that just meshed well at first.
Eliana (ESFJ): I think obviously there's a physical attraction and connection and I felt the same way towards him. I also think, it's funny because with his personality type being an introvert, Jon is somewhere between an introvert and an extrovert, sometimes he's very introverted, sometimes he can be more extroverted. I would say he has this very sort of charming part of him, a social charming part that can come out sometimes. I feel like when we first started dating, he definitely was pulling out the charm. And I remember that. And also, like you said, we were just sharing very openly and honestly, and I think it's rare on a first date to really find that. And I feel like so often, on a first date, everyone's putting up a front and trying to be a different version of themselves to really be able to impress that other person. And I didn't feel that way from him. I felt like he was just really being authentically himself and I felt like I was able to be completely authentically myself. And I think that's like the key to a successful relationship. If you could show up on your first date and just totally be you, you're going be really great going forward. So I think that definitely was big for me.
Jess (INFP): It's interesting what you said about Jon having some extroverted tendencies because ISFJs are probably the most people-orientated introverts. So quite often they can seem like extroverts because they're very natural when it comes to interactions with people. They’re good communicators. And they do genuinely tend to really like people it’s just they can't be around them all the time.
Jon (ISFJ): I need my alone time.
Jess (INFP): And when did you first consider yourself a couple?
Jon (ISFJ): I was drunk on some street in New York and I was like, “Are we dating? Or what? What are we doing here?” I've never had to say that before. And I'm not trying to sound overconfident but it's always been the opposite with me playing it cool. I’d be like, “Oh, I don't want a girlfriend” kind of thing. But with her I was like, “Wait, are we girlfriend and boyfriend or are you playing around with me still?” It was probably like a month or two into it. I remember.
Eliana (ESFJ): Yeah, yeah, I remember that. I remember that.
Jon (ISFJ): I don't know if that was the point at which we figured it out but that's what always hits my head. I remember being drunk on that street in New York when we went out. And I remember just asking you.
Eliana (ESFJ): That was, I think when we “made it official”. From the time that we went on our first date, we were seeing each other pretty much all the time. It was unofficially official. But I think at that point it was kind of when we were like, “Okay, let's make this official.”
Jon (ISFJ): Yes, so like a month or month and a half into it.
Lou (ESFJ): So when did you guys first discover your personality types?
Elaina: So I remember specifically with Myers-Briggs, that's something I had done a number of times professionally at different jobs that I've had. And I know that in the past I've done it and I couldn't really remember exactly, but I always knew that I was an extrovert. I always remember that I've always been an extrovert. I actually feel like my letters were probably the same as it has been over the past few years. I don't know about you. You've done Myers-Briggs too, right?
Jon (ISFJ): I've done Myers-Briggs, I’ve also done the DISC personality tests. And I feel like I've done them more casually. When you do them and you’re like, “Oh, that feels so right. That's who I am.” And then that information kind of falls by the wayside, which is why I like your app so much because it puts that information out there and then it pairs you based off of that. And it kind of puts it in the forefront. It's such great information. I mean, how people, how a couple typically figures all that stuff out is through trial and error and I'm sure most couples don't even ever figure that out. And then eventually probably part because of that. So I wish I had this information earlier on and not even just having it, but utilized it. Both for myself, because it's great to know what works for you and what doesn't, but also your partner and how they operate because we come from two different backgrounds, we're two different people, we have two different personalities. Certain things come out just naturally through being in a relationship but it’s great if you have that information earlier on. So I figured that information out, or I took a test years ago, but I didn't really ever do anything with it. And it kind of took Eliana to really but bring it back up and be like, well, you're definitely like this so let's tailor it a little bit towards that. This is a long-winded way, which is my forte, of saying I learned about it years ago, but I'm now just starting to, over the past year or so, utilize it more with her.
Jess (INFP): That’s such a great way to look at it. And I think it's so important to remember it's a framework and it's not like every single word will absolutely accurately describe everyone. But it is a really, really good guide. And with any complex system or person, it just really helps to have a framework to understand it. So whether it's understanding yourself or understanding your partner, like you said, you could maybe work some of it out through trial and error, but it would probably take a long time. But if you just have this framework, you put some parameters and some words around it, it can really help. I think a lot of relationships could be smoother and probably happier if people spent more time trying to understand the other person and probably themselves as well, really.
Jon (ISFJ): Yeah, definitely. And I think Eliana and I are both two self-aware people who do exploration into our own minds and how we work. It's another reason why I think we work so well because if we have an issue, we try to understand why we feel a certain way. Not that we're perfect. She's a lot better at it than I am, but I try to understand why do I react that kind of way? Why do I not want to be in that group of people when you do? Why do I get mad at her? Well, she realizes that I have some introverted tendencies and “maybe we won't go to that or maybe he needs some alone time. That's not a reflection of me. That's just Jon needs his alone time. That's just who he is. That's how he decompresses or something.”
Eliana (ESFJ): Exactly. And I think that actually comes up a lot with couples, especially with couples with an introvert and an extrovert, where he needs more alone time than I do. Even with my clients that I work with who are in relationships, I've heard them say, “well, like he wants to be alone a lot or she wants to be alone lot. He doesn't want to be around me.” And it becomes a fight. Like, “That's so rude. You want to be by yourself. We're a couple, we should always want to be together.” And it's like, first of all, no, that's not the case. And second of all, that makes so much sense. As an introvert, you need your alone time. It's not at all a reflection of myself, but it's a reflection of your personality.
Lou (ESFJ): So what kind of things do you guys talk about?
Jon (ISFJ): It has been centered around our baby right now. He's taking all the spotlight.
Eliana (ESFJ): We always joke that we can get into the deepest, longest conversations, especially, and even still now with the baby, but when we used to go out on regular date nights. I mean, I think for both of us, we really are into personal development and personal growth and talk a lot about ways that we can improve ourselves and just communicate better and so many different things like that.
Jon (ISFJ): Like I said, the past four months have been all about our son. What kind of family do we want to raise? What kind of values do we want to instil? Eliana’s building her business, her millennial success coaching business and I’m in the real estate game, I'm looking at buying small businesses. So, in addition to creating this system as to how we're going to raise our family and what goals we want for that, really, we’re just both fostering and encouraging each other to go after our own goals in terms of building business and other stuff along those lines. So it's been a lot. I personally have been all over the place, a new dad, buying real estate, figuring out the next move, all of that. And then obviously with trying to be a supportive husband and then finding alone time for us. So yeah, like four or five months ago, there was a lot more time for us to talk and plot things out and spend time together. It's been a little more difficult now with baby number one, but we've definitely made it work. And how lucky am I that I've been able to work from home?
Jess (INFP): And how do you guys deal with conflict?
Eliana (ESFJ): So I think really early on, and it's actually a product of having had a lot of crappy relationships in the past that taught me a lot where I always felt like I would sweep my feelings under the rug and I was nervous to be authentic and show up authentically, and so I think for us, and something I probably said to Jon from the outset, I was like, “I always want to be upfront. I always want to communicate how I'm feeling really honestly, whether you agree or disagree, I don't ever want to feel like my feelings are invalid or that I can't share my feelings with you.” So I think honesty to an extreme point, always voicing how I feel, always voicing how he feels, has allowed us to sort of…
I mean, listen, we're of course going to have conflict. I always say any couple that says they don't fight either sweeps everything under the rug or they're lying to you. All couples have arguments. For us, we've always been able to communicate really honestly, even when we're frustrated. And if we do feel like things are sort of tensing and boiling up, we've now learned to press the pause button and walk away, give each other a little time to reflect and come together. And we'll say like, “Okay, this is not the right time. We're both escalating. Let's talk about this tomorrow when we’ve both decompressed a little bit.” And I think that's something that we were pretty good at early on, but as the years have gone on and we've learned about each other even more, and learned our types of personalities and how we handle fights or arguments, we've gotten even better at that. So I think conflict resolution is something that we've been able to get really strong at and really figure out how to manage each other in that way.
Jon (ISFJ): I agree with all that. It's been huge and it was tough at first. I mean, she mentioned where we were good early on and maybe not so early, early on. You know, Eliana comes from a family where they talk about everything. If it’s the most mundane thing, they talk about for 50 minutes about it and dive deep into it. Whereas my family was more like, I don't want to say lack of depth, but we didn't express ourselves, it was more surface level. At the dinner table, we were just having these surface level conversations. And if there was a fight, there was never really any conflict resolution. It was you scream, you scream, you go that way, you go that way, brush it under the rug. So I grew up with that model, and invariably in any relationship, there's obviously going to be conflict, so I brought that model into it, whereas Eliana is the opposite, like I said. She just says, “Well, I want to know everything about this. Why are we feeling this way? Let's talk for 20 minutes.” And obviously I always just like, “I don't care, you win,” which is obviously not healthy. So pretty early on when we started being like, “Alright, we can't operate like this, this isn't a good model for us. Let's find some middle ground where, if we're in a conflict, let’s take a little break. You go that way for a little bit. I'll go this way. But five minutes later, we're going to sit down and figure this out.” And it doesn't need to be an hour long discussion, but it's an open unemotional resolution to whatever the issue is at hand, which has been great because I'm definitely the more emotional one. And the one who's, maybe this is a male thing, but it's just like, “Okay, I don't care anymore,” but this allows the emotion to subside. And then for me to really express myself and be like, “Well, this is actually how I feel. I hope you understand that. And here's some compromise.” That's how we approach it. It's not perfect every time, but that's the framework that we try to follow.
Lou (ESFJ): So what did you like most about each other's personality?
Eliana (ESFJ): I think what I love most about Jon is what I learned really on our first date. He's super honest. He is always trying to better himself. I could tell, just the fact that I was meeting with this guy who was telling me that he had a life coach he was working with and trying to meet all these new goals. I love that he was just so into personal development and self-development. And he's just a very loving and nurturing person. He’s always there for me, always supportive of me if I'm ever going through a hard time.
Jon (ISFJ): That was very sweet. I think the biggest things that I love about her personality, I think first and foremost, if this girl says she's going to do something, she's going to do it. She says she's going to do so many things. And she actually does it. One day she's like, “I'm going to climb Mount Kilimanjaro.” A year later, she's there with her dad climbing and she's not an outdoorsy person and she did it. And I was like, “What!?” And then she left her job and started her own business and she's been doing it for over a year and she just does it. She takes risks and I've always been one who's been afraid of that. As I've gotten older, I've definitely implemented that more, but seeing my wife do that has definitely given me the confidence to do it myself. So there's that.
I think I alluded to this before, I'm more of a defensive person and to see her, maybe me not criticize, but even offer constructive criticism and to see her accept it and implement it and not feel embarrassed by it or put up this guard like, “Oh, I know what I'm doing. I don't need your guidance on it” because she's not afraid to operate. So there's that. She's super empathetic. She sees a dying cat on TV, she'll be crying. She feels for people that come from different places from her that don't have the same experiences. And then, she's an amazing mother and at the end of the day, she's a clown. She doesn't think she's funny, but she. This girl makes me die of laughter every day. Our son was over here an hour ago and she's dancing like a circus animal trying to make him laugh. And I'm just looking at her and I'm like, “This is my wife!” I'm laughing more at her than the baby is like and I get more entertainment out of it, but she just makes me smile all the time.
Jess (INFP): Slightly different question, is there anything you would change about each other's personalities?
Eliana (ESFJ): It's funny because we were talking about this before and I feel like one of the things that I always talk a lot about with clients is that you can't change people, right? To truly have a successful relationship, you have to recognize that people are the way they are, and you have to be accepting of that. I think that there are always things that you want to work on together in relationships and be aware of like, “Oh, that trait is harder for me and can we work on it in a way that's going to be more comfortable,” but I would never want to change him. I think he alluded to before sometimes he gets defensive, so we work on that. If he's getting defensive and I'm getting upset by that, I'll communicate that with him and be like, I feel like you're getting defensive now. And then we talk it through. So it's not really anything I would want to change, but it's more so things that are different about us that we're aware of so that we can communicate honestly about it and work through it if it's coming up.
Jon (ISFJ): I think the only thing I want her to improve upon is she's a little bit of a hypochondriac.
Eliana (ESFJ): Yes!
Jon (ISFJ): A little hypochondriac when it comes to health and especially with our son, although she's not, you haven't been terrible, but her brother is in med school right now so she calls him all the time. She tends to worry, not even just about health, about, you know, finances or packing for our trip, just to worry about crazy stuff.
Eliana (ESFJ): I’m working on that.
Jess (INFP): ESFJs do tend to be worriers
Lou (ESFJ): And then what challenges have you guys faced as a couple?
Eliana (ESFJ): I mean, honestly, most recently, even just the pandemic. I think being pregnant during a pandemic was a really challenging time, not being able to be around family and navigating…I had just, a few months before, started my business. So I was at home pregnant trying to start a business, couldn't be with anybody. He was navigating working from home for the first time in his life and we were in a one-bedroom apartment. There was a lot going on. And I think that that was definitely challenging for us in a lot of ways, but also really great for us in a lot of ways and taught us a lot about boundaries. And again, continuing to keep that open and honest communication and staying positive and lifting each other up when we were having harder days and everything. We literally got married, got pregnant right after and then went into the pandemic. So our first year of marriage had a lot going on in it but I think it's also been like a massive year of growth for both of us as well.
Jon (ISFJ): For sure. I think the biggest challenge for me is really our families. We come from two completely different families. Her family is a little more religious than mine. I come from a different financial background, we're just different. And the families, they obviously mould you to a certain way. Once you hit a certain age, you become your own person, but there's obviously residual effects of how you were raised and all that. But, like any couple, when you come from two diverse backgrounds, you think that your way is the right way. And that's when the ego gets involved a little bit and it goes back to conflict resolution and we've definitely worked on it. But now that we have a son, and like I mentioned, figuring out how we want to raise him, we do not have completely different scripts for that, but there's some differences there that we're working out and I think we have worked out through compromising and all of that. So that's been the biggest challenge I think, in addition to obviously the pandemic, although we haven't had it so bad.
Jess (INFP): Yeah. You guys are quite similar personality types in the big scheme of things. Do you have similar strengths and weaknesses or do you have some kind of different strengths and weaknesses?
Eliana (ESFJ): I think that we definitely have similar strengths in a lot of ways. I think we're both really good listeners. When we really want to talk to one another, I know that if I really needed support, he’ll listen intently to me and same goes back for myself, I'm always here to listen to him and I think that's one of the keys to our effective communication. In terms of weaknesses, I feel that all those traits that we were just talking about, like me being a big worrier and caught up and bogged down sometimes in the minutia and the details, that's definitely a weakness of mine that I feel is more so a strength for you. You can sometimes think bigger picture than I can, or he can compartmentalize a lot better than I can. So I feel like some similar strengths, but definitely also different weaknesses.
Lou (ESFJ): And then the final question, what are you guys most looking forward to in your future together?
Jon (ISFJ): Although I am terrified of having another kid because one is manageable and I hear all the stories about two and three, I'm very excited for that. I'm excited for us to be this team that really works with our children and we have all these fun adventures together and we work through challenges and we teach, I'm so excited for that. We haven't hit that phase yet; I'm not teaching our son Levi anything yet. He’s just becoming less of a blob and more of a person. But I'm so excited for us just to be able to walk down the street and tell our children what that is or what that is and have these different experiences together. I think it's going to be magical.
Eliana (ESFJ): I definitely echo that. I also think more professionally, and I guess for us as a couple too, as Jon mentioned, I started my own business and, I always say Jon is multi-passionate entrepreneur. There was a lot of different things that he's delving into. And I think for both of us, we've always wanted to do our own things, be self-sufficient and we’ve always been interested in leaving the corporate world. It’s not really for us. And I'm just excited for us to both build something separately, but also together, and see how we can create that life of freedom where we can do what we want to do professionally, that we love, be able to be with our family, be present with our family and really build a life that we can be really proud of.
Lou (ESFJ): That’s so cute. I love the whole story of how you met at a party and then met later on a dating app.
Jon (ISFJ): Like I said before, just to think about that that's how it started is just mind-blowing. So to have this trip of going down memory lane with you guys on this podcast and remembering how all started is just reliving the past right now and appreciating today because today wasn't guaranteed. I’m not really a fatalist so I don't think this was predetermined, but the fact that we're here after all that… I could've deleted that app and I could be someone else right now, but something brought us together and I'm very happy for that. Baby boy slept the whole time too.
Lou (ESFJ): Thank you so much for coming on Personality Love Lab.
Jess (INFP): Thank you so much.
Jon (ISFJ): Thank you for having us.
Eliana (ESFJ): This was so fun.
Lou (ESFJ): Thank you for listening to Personality Love Lab. We hope you enjoyed hearing this love story about personality type compatibility, and don't forget to click subscribe.
Jess (INFP): And if you're looking for your own love story, head over to your app store now and download So Syncd, the dating app that matches compatible personality types. It’s free and you can find people who are looking to connect on a deeper level.